It’s the fourth Wednesday of the month, which means it’s time for another deep dive into the RV industry, outdoor recreation, and activities! Join us on March 27th, 2025, at 2 PM EST for expert insights, emerging trends, and engaging conversations you won’t want to miss!

We’re excited to welcome Natalie Conway, Executive Director of the Ontario Recreation Vehicle Dealers Association, who will discuss the current state of the RV market in Canada and how dealerships are navigating industry challenges and opportunities in 2025. Joining her is Aaron Bannon, Executive Director of the America Outdoors Association, who will discuss the growing importance of sustainability and conservation efforts in outdoor recreation.

Rounding out the episode, host Brian Searl will be joined by an outstanding lineup of recurring guests, including: Eleanore Hamm, President of RVDA Canada; Angele Miller, Co-founder of Creekside RnR Glamping; Shane Devenish, President of CRVA; Greg Emmert, Co-founder of Camp Strategy; and Phil Ingrassia, Executive Director of RVDA.

March 19th Episode Recap

The March 19, 2025, episode of MC Fireside Chats centered on business operations and management in the outdoor hospitality industry, featuring a diverse panel of recurring and special guests. Host Brian Searl was joined by Mike Harrison, Sandy Ellingson, and Ali Rasmussen, along with special guests Katie McLeod, General Manager of Quilly’s RV Parks, and John, Beth, and Ali Kieffer, owners of the Blue Ridge Dakota River KOA in Georgia. The discussion covered a wide range of topics, from technology and consumer trends to the evolving demographics of campers and the challenges faced by campground owners.

The conversation began with Brian highlighting the importance of choosing the right online reservation system, emphasizing that campground owners should prioritize systems with open API access. He explained that APIs allow for seamless data integration, automation, and enhanced analytics, ultimately improving efficiency and decision-making. Sandy agreed, reinforcing that consumers want a streamlined experience without needing multiple tools, and that open APIs allow campgrounds to integrate the best features from different platforms. She pointed out that many reservation systems claim they are working on integrations but often fail to deliver them in a timely manner. With a robust API, owners can build their own integrations without relying on software developers.

Shifting gears, the discussion turned to the decline in Canadian travelers visiting U.S. campgrounds. Ali Rasmussen noted a dramatic 70% drop in Canadian visitors at her properties, a trend that has forced her to rethink advertising and marketing strategies. While some campground owners, like Katie McLeod, reported an increase in Canadian guests at their Texas properties, others, particularly in Georgia and New England, have seen significant declines. Mike Harrison explained that he had noticed booking trends weakening as early as mid-2024 and attributed part of the decline to economic factors, including the weakening Canadian dollar and rising tariffs. Brian added that rhetoric around the “51st state” concept had also alienated Canadian travelers, leading many to cancel U.S. trips in protest. Sandy Ellingson questioned whether the decline was solely due to travel restrictions or if it was also tied to a broader shift in demographics, where older generations of campers are not being replaced by younger ones.

This led to a larger discussion about the changing profile of campers. Sandy shared insights from ongoing industry research, which suggests that traditional camping demographics are shifting. She noted that many long-time campers are aging out of the industry, and younger generations are not adopting RVing and camping at the same rate. She referred to this shift as the “death of the camper and the rise of the traveler,” emphasizing that modern outdoor enthusiasts often view camping differently. Instead of seeing it as a long-term lifestyle choice, many younger travelers prefer shorter, more curated outdoor experiences. Brian agreed and pointed out that glamping, cabin rentals, and tent sites are potential entry points for this new demographic. Sandy announced that the research findings would soon be shared with the industry at upcoming conferences, with the goal of helping campground owners adapt to these changes.

The conversation also touched on the challenges of encouraging curiosity and adaptability among campground owners. John and Beth Kieffer discussed their experience as KOA franchisees, emphasizing how KOA’s extensive data and support systems have helped them refine their operations and improve guest experiences. However, John noted that many long-time KOA owners are resistant to change and hesitant to upgrade their facilities, despite KOA’s recommendations. He explained that some owners blindly rely on past success rather than adapting to evolving guest expectations, which could lead to difficulties in the future. Beth added that financial constraints often contribute to this reluctance, as many owners worry about the costs associated with infrastructure upgrades. Brian suggested that curiosity is a key factor in success, questioning whether it can be taught or if it is an inherent trait. Katie McLeod expressed skepticism, stating that while curiosity is difficult to instill, setting clear expectations for staff and fostering a culture of learning can help bridge the gap.

Ali Rasmussen raised another important question about how the industry can attract younger generations to camping and RVing. She pointed out that Millennials and Gen Z often avoid physically demanding activities, which could pose a challenge for traditional RVing, which requires setup and maintenance. Katie shared an innovative approach she has seen at some parks, where campgrounds offer “first setup” services to help new RV owners learn the basics. She explained that her own park manager regularly assists guests with their first-time setup, creating an emotional connection that makes them more likely to return. Sandy added that a successful initiative she has worked on involves partnerships between campgrounds and RV dealerships, where dealerships host “maiden voyage” experiences at campgrounds, teaching new RV owners the essentials of setting up and troubleshooting their rigs. These programs not only create better experiences for first-time campers but also help build long-term loyalty.

The discussion then turned to the importance of offering diverse experiences that go beyond traditional camping. Brian emphasized the need to foster a deeper passion for the outdoors, rather than just selling amenities. John and Beth Kieffer shared how they have introduced additional services at their KOA, such as food trucks, fly fishing lessons, and winery tours, all of which enhance the guest experience without adding significant operational costs. Brian encouraged owners to think outside the box, suggesting that activities like survival skills workshops, guided hikes, and even foraging experiences could create lasting memories and a deeper appreciation for the outdoors.

As the episode wrapped up, each panelist shared their final thoughts. John Kieffer warned that the rising cost of building new campgrounds—now averaging $60,000 per site—could push prices even higher, potentially making camping less accessible. Sandy reiterated the importance of actively onboarding new guests and attracting younger travelers to sustain the industry’s long-term growth. Katie emphasized the need to create unique, nature-focused experiences that encourage guests to disconnect and reconnect with the outdoors. Ali echoed this sentiment, adding that fostering a sense of community at campgrounds is just as important as providing great amenities. She noted that people are increasingly seeking meaningful human connections and that campgrounds should embrace that need by designing experiences that encourage interaction and shared moments.

Brian concluded the show by reflecting on the broader challenge of capturing people’s attention in an era of digital distractions. He argued that the passion for the outdoors is still there, but it is competing with an overwhelming amount of digital content and entertainment. To remain relevant, campground owners must not only adapt their offerings but also find innovative ways to communicate the value of outdoor experiences to new audiences. With so many factors shaping the industry’s future, from economic shifts to changing traveler expectations, the key takeaway was clear—those who embrace curiosity, adaptability, and a forward-thinking approach will be best positioned for success.

About MC Fireside Chats

MC Fireside Chats is a live podcast experience dedicated to the outdoor hospitality and outdoor recreation industries. Hosted by Brian Searl, founder and CEO of Insider Perks and Modern Campground, the show offers engaging discussions with industry leaders, innovators, and experts shaping the future of camping, RVing, glamping, and outdoor recreation.

Airing every Wednesday at 2 p.m. (ET), the show follows a structured weekly theme to deliver deep dives into the most relevant topics:

• Week 1: Industry Trends & Insights
• Week 2: Enhancing Guest Experience
• Week 3: Business Operations & Management
• Week 4: RV Industry, Outdoor Recreation & Activities

Each episode features a panel of recurring guests, complemented by 1–2 rotating special guests, including industry analysts, campground owners, technology providers, sustainability advocates, and more. Whether exploring the latest market trends or innovative guest experience strategies, MC Fireside Chats delivers thought-provoking insights for professionals and enthusiasts across the outdoor recreation spectrum.

To explore previous episodes of MC Fireside Chats, visit: moderncampground.com/mc-fireside-chats.